‘The Other Side of the Wind’ being finished in Los Angeles for Netflix

[admusicam]

I realy hope the all original Welles work print will be published in the future (as a bonus dvd or download streaming). If fragmentary, it is "a way" to see this film...

NB: I confess... I dream other "privates montages" of the film, using some portions of TOSOFW party to present and organize fragments of "marchent of venice", "the deep", "moby dick" or welles unfinished fragment projects instead of Hanaford film... of course heretic combination... but... why not?

[jbrooks]

One thing I'm curious about: This reel labeled "Sex" is reportedly the footage of Kodar and Random having precisely that in the car and is, ostensibly, a scene from Hannaford's unfinished feature. Wasn't the footage of the "feature film" within the film of TOSOTW shot on 35mm while other formats (16mm, Super 8, videotape) were used for "documenting" everything else going on in the film? I'm surprised that the reel is labeled "16mm".

The first few times I saw the car sex scene, I assumed that it was not part of the film within a film because it appeared to be 16mm, handheld and had a choppy editing style that, to me, seemed to match more the cinema verite style of the party scenes than the pristine looking movie-within-the-movie footage shot. I was surprised to later realize that this scene was intended to be part of Hannaford's film.
Of course, I can't be sure from looking at it that it was shot in 16mm. (It might just be a bad print or the workprint could have been printed in 16 mm for editing) In One Man Band, however, Oja describes filming some of this scene in their backyard in Paris, with a garden hose making the rain. Given the low-scale of that sort of filming arrangement, it would not be surprising if it were shot on 16mm

[Roger Ryan]

It occurs to me that Welles may have considered the 16mm format perfectly acceptable for a sequence primarily confined to the inside of a car, even if it was meant to represent a scene from Hannaford's film. Years later, he discussed using 35mm to shoot long shots for his King Lear project, but videotape to do the close-ups, understanding that the higher resolution of the film format would be needed to effectively capture the details of actors and sets seen at a distance whereas a close-up of a face could be rendered satisfactorily in a lower resolution format. Given that the car scene in TOSOTW is all "in your face" tight shots, he probably thought a higher resolution film format was unnecessary.

[Wellesnet]

Slight update from Hollywood Elsewhere:
http://www.hollywood-elsewhere.com/2017 ... goes-west/

It was announced last March that Netflix has acquired global rights to Orson Welles’ unfinished The Other Side of the Wind, and that it will finance the completion of this allegedly out-there film, which was shot in pieces (and on different film formats) between 1970 and ’76.

30-plus years ago director and longtime Welles collaborator Peter Bogdanovich promised Welles he would finish TOSOTW if the latter wasn’t able to. Welles died in ’85 at age 70. I ran into Bogdanovich yesterday at a party and asked how things are going.

The editing is finally beginning this month, he said. All the elements are in Los Angeles, and “1000 reels” are now being scanned and digitized. Peter and a couple of other guys will naturally have to look at everything and then begin this bear of a task. They have that 40-minute assemblage that Orson cut together plus some notes he left behind. “Any chance you’ll make the 2018 Cannes Film festival?,” I asked. Peter shrugged, said something inconclusive.

I talked this morning to a guy who’s heard a couple of things: “It’s a big job. Nineteen hours of footage. They’re aiming for Cannes.”

[MartynH]

As many of us are waiting for the film to see the light of day, I got thinking about how good is it going to be. Of course, I'm hoping it will be up there with Welles's best. This led me to think in a more positive way. I thought about one of my favourite films which was put together in similar circumstances - that is Jean Renoir's 'A Day in the Countryside'. Yes, I know it's only 40 minutes long, but it is a masterpiece. I believe the film was assembled by Renoir's friends/associates while he was in the USA. So I remain very hopeful.

[jbrooks]

As many of us are waiting for the film to see the light of day, I got thinking about how good is it going to be. Of course, I'm hoping it will be up there with Welles's best.

Sadly, I don't think there's much chance that it will be up there with Welles' best. The script is not great. It has a lot of interesting elements, but it's kind of a mess. Welles the writer was always at his best when adapting novels. His original material suffers by comparison -- see, for example, Mr. Arkadin, The Big Brass Ring, and The Cradle Will Rock. Maybe the style and the performances can make up for the script's shortcomings, but that's a lot for which to hope. We do know for a fact that the film has some dynamite sequences because we've already seen some. The car/sex sequence, the party arrival scene, the Norman Foster screening room scene, and particularly the Huston scene with Dale's old English teacher are all terrific.

My hope is that there are few more terrific sequences that we haven't seen and that it all hangs together cohesively. I also hope (but am doubtful) that some of the comedy will play better than it seems to in the rough cut. (The scene with the journalists hanging off the car and the scenes with all the dummies seem terrible, but might play better when polished).

Even it all works great on its own terms (again, a big "if"), those terms are more akin to "F for Fake" than to "Citizen Kane." It's hand held cameras and quick-cut, disorienting montage editing. There's no deep focus and no tracking shots. And there's no Welles performance in front of the camera to charm us.

So the best case scenario, I think, is a film that Welles fans might love but that few will think equals "Kane" or "Chimes." Worst case scenario, there's not enough footage to even make a cohesive film, and everyone acknowledges that there's no real finished movie there at all.

[RayKelly]

So the best case scenario, I think, is a film that Welles fans might love but that few will think equals "Kane" or "Chimes." Worst case scenario, there's not enough footage to even make a cohesive film, and everyone acknowledges that there's no real finished movie there at all.

Having seen the 105-minute assembly created by Mazzola/Graver and some additional material, I think there is enough footage for a cohesive film. Is it Citizen Kane? No, but neither is any other film I have seen.
The one-on-one scenes with Peter Bogdanovich and John Huston talking about the MIA John Dale and Jake's finances are the heart and soul of the movie. The performances are first rate. It would be nice to see the Huston and Lilli Palmer footage skillfully edited together because it has potential. Gregory Sierra as a macho John Milius style filmmaker is great in his scenes with Bogdanovich. Big departure from his Barney Miller character.

[nickleschichoney]

The script is not great. It has a lot of interesting elements, but it's kind of a mess. Welles the writer was always at his best when adapting novels. His original material suffers by comparison -- see, for example, Mr. Arkadin, The Big Brass Ring, and The Cradle Will Rock.

I think MR. ARKADIN mostly suffers from bad editing. (As I've said, depending on how you edit the film, you can make Arden's character a badly-acted antihero or a well-acted douchebag.) What's the problem with THE BIG BRASS RING and THE CRADLE WILL ROCK? I kinda liked both.

Also, I think we have to remember that Welles's screenplays got better on set, as he interacted with his actors and understood their personalities and limits more. I mean, he'd extensively rewrite his scripts before and during filming, especially with TOSotW.

[jbrooks]

What's the problem with THE BIG BRASS RING and THE CRADLE WILL ROCK? I kinda liked both.

It's been 30 years since I read "The Big Brass Ring" so I can't give specifics. But I've read "The Cradle Will Rock" a bit more recently than that and my recollection is that it has no story, no character development, no arc, and no real drama at all. It's a series of mildly charming scenes -- with an emphasis on "mildly."

I think "Wind" might be better than either "Ring" or "Cradle." But I'm worried that the heart of the drama might be too subtle or that some of the crucial scenes weren't filmed. The Hannaford-Dale relationship is the dramatic core of the story, but for the most part, it's not the focus of the action of the film. Thus, it will be challenging task to make that work.

[nickleschichoney]

It's been 30 years since I read "The Big Brass Ring" so I can't give specifics. But I've read "The Cradle Will Rock" a bit more recently than that and my recollection is that it has no story, no character development, no arc, and no real drama at all. It's a series of mildly charming scenes -- with an emphasis on "mildly."

I respect your opinion, but I disagree. I gathered that the central conflict was whether Welles the young director could bring about a powerful opera in spite of his emotional volatility. In the end, in spite of the apparent chaos and the crackdown on the opera, Welles pulls it off in an unexpected way. I like Welles's portrait of Blitzstein (a strong-willed idealist who becomes increasingly weary of Welles's behavior) and even his portrait of John Houseman -- Houseman actually comes across as somewhat-sympathetic in Welles's script! As for Welles's self-portrait, it's rather complex and often unflattering.

Sorry for the digression... onto WIND...

I think "Wind" might be better than either "Ring" or "Cradle." But I'm worried that the heart of the drama might be too subtle or that some of the crucial scenes weren't filmed. The Hannaford-Dale relationship is the dramatic core of the story, but for the most part, it's not the focus of the action of the film. Thus, it will be challenging task to make that work.

Dale definitely hangs over everything, but I think Hannaford's relationships with his friends, old (Billy Boyle, Zarah Valeska) and young (Otterlake), provide the dramatic core of the story. His relationship with Dale seems to be a kind of starting point against which all his other relationships are tested and explored.

[jbrooks]

I respect your opinion, but I disagree. I gathered that the central conflict was whether Welles the young director could bring about a powerful opera in spite of his emotional volatility. In the end, in spite of the apparent chaos and the crackdown on the opera, Welles pulls it off in an unexpected way. I like Welles's portrait of Blitzstein (a strong-willed idealist who becomes increasingly weary of Welles's behavior) and even his portrait of John Houseman -- Houseman actually comes across as somewhat-sympathetic in Welles's script! As for Welles's self-portrait, it's rather complex and often unflattering.

This sounds so much better than the script I recall that I'm tempted to read it again. My recollections are that the characterizations are so nuanced as to be barely there. Most of what we learn about the characters comes just from direct statements of what the characters say or what other characters say about them. My recollection is that character isn't revealed through action and that there's little subtext. But I'd be delighted if I were wrong. Maybe I'll give it another read.

[jbrooks]

Dale definitely hangs over everything, but I think Hannaford's relationships with his friends, old (Billy Boyle, Zarah Valeska) and young (Otterlake), provide the dramatic core of the story. His relationship with Dale seems to be a kind of starting point against which all his other relationships are tested and explored.

I think this is probably right. But I think the statement that Hannaford's other relationships "are tested and explored" overstates it somewhat. Very little happens in the story, and very little is "tested and explored." Hannaford has a number of interactions with friends, antagonists and cronies, but I don't think any of those relationships are "tested" in a dramatic sense. The only relationship story that has an arc is the relationship with Dale. (Of course, I could be wrong -- as I've only read one version of the script and have only seen lots of rough cut scenes).

[nickleschichoney]

This sounds so much better than the script I recall that I'm tempted to read it again. My recollections are that the characterizations are so nuanced as to be barely there. Most of what we learn about the characters comes just from direct statements of what the characters say or what other characters say about them. My recollection is that character isn't revealed through action and that there's little subtext. But I'd be delighted if I were wrong. Maybe I'll give it another read.

It's how I read it, anyway. Welles's character is complex because that's how Welles just was -- incredibly unpredictable and mercurial, even in his later years. As for the lack of subtext, I agree... and only because Welles's movies don't strike me as being that subtle. They're incredibly complex texts to the point where, imo, there's no room for subtext. Everything is just out there, you know?

[RayKelly]

Hearing from Indiegogo donors that the Maverick T-shirts have been shipped.
Thanks to Peter Rinaldi for the photo!

[Wellesnet]

A great interview with Frank Marshall and Peter Jason was quietly uploaded to Vimeo last month, but sadly was taken down shortly after we found out about it. A brief description of it can be found here:
http://www.wellesnet.com/video-peter-ja ... -the-wind/