the new f-for-fake - is it the same as the old f-for-fake

[R Kadin]

Yes, I remember the official Criterion response about the trailer, as reported previously in a related thread. As I recall, it amounted to the prospect of but a few weeks' delay (if that) getting the better of the decision-making process for a release that had already been waiting in the wings for years.

It just seemed so out of keeping with the patient and respectful work that had gone into the restoration of the film, proper. The sheer incongruity of it can't help but set the imagination to racing, thinking about what must have been the real story.

But, if it did simply come down to the making of what, in hindsight, might have been a rash decision for mere expediency's sake, let's hope that Criterion resists similar temptations in the future.

[catbuglah]

The well-researched Elmer de Hory documentary on the extra DVD fills in many interesting details about his life and his sad end. It's also interesting how it's style is almost anti-Welles - totally how Welles wouldn't make a documentary - linear, no editorial or philosophical viewpoint, safe, conventional, unpoetic -

I was most struck by the footage for the Dreamers in the One-Man Band piece, looks like an enchanting piece of Wellesian wonder.

[Chirpy_Sabz]

I was most struck by the footage for the Dreamers in the One-Man Band piece, looks like an enchanting piece of Wellesian wonder.

oh me too! I really wish Orson had a chance to finish it ???

[maxrael]

great post Lawrence... this is the kind of thing we could perhaps have in an FAQ somewhere?

it's proving to be another tragedy, (in a story perhaps already overrun with them) that Criterion and Filmmuseum Muenchen appear to be at odds with each other. The FfF trailer was bad enough, but the new version of Arkadin?!! it's just so frustrating...

For newcomers the thread which we're referring to can be found: here

[TheMcGuffin]

I recently shot Criterion an e-mail about their release of Mr. Arkadin and about not including the new cut of the film. Surprisingly i got a reply saying:

"We hope to release MR. ARKADIN in the future, but nothing is certain at this
time. No definite decisions regarding disc content have been made.

best,
JM"

But this can mean anything...

[catbuglah]

Just saw Arkadin again - bought this lousy quality Madacy video of the British version (along with the Third Man - hadn't seen that one in a while - beautifully filmed) It's one of my favorite Welles - it's like a crux of all his pet themes at mid-point of development- I love the pre-french new-wave style - innovative! Visually, Welles is for me the viusal poet-laureate of moving sound pictures, and he's in fine form here, inspired. Despite the Aristotle Onassis references, unless a new version clarifies logical inconsistencies, this film is an almost total fairy tale to me - Welles is this unreal Blue Beard, Faust personage - that bad actor is the simpleton, pure-intentioned fairy tale hero there are, of course, explicit allusions ('I call my father 'The Ogre', Raina - Queen - the bubbling Oedipalness of it all, the castle, etc...) - The Munich version sounds awesome - I hope they work things out...

Cheers,

Mark

[chrissie]

Delurking again, anyone got info on this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws....08&rd=1

It lists a running time of 98 mins. My UK (Metrodome) DVD* of same runs for 93.5 mins... so, is this something particularly interesting or a potential waste of cash?

(*I do mean Confidential Report, not that horrible thing with the Tony Curtis intro, obv.)

[etimh]

Hey, check out this bootleg version of Mr. Arkadin:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws....VW&rd=1

Although this guy seems to use several different ebay id's and is obviously producing bootleg DVDs, someone I know bought this for 10 bucks and was very pleased. I borrowed it and it seemed good to me though I am no expert on Arkadin (don't know the specifics on all versions). The transfer seemed adequate and the re-packaging was surprizingly well-done.

I DO NOT know this seller and there are probably some sketchy things about him (several different or changing id's?). Then again, he might just be an anti-copyright/free-use crusader. More power to him. Regardless, my friend said that he recieved the DVD in a timely manner and in excellent, brand-new condition.

Can anyone else comment on the details of the version and/or quality of the transfer on this bootleg?

I'm wondering if its worth adding to my own collection.

Tim

[Knowles Noel Shane]

Chrissie, that Ebay item states that it is the Criterion release version on Arkadin, but I didn't think that there has been a Criterion version. Anyone know if there was a Criterion laserdisc years ago? I would guess that it's actually the print titled Confidential Report. The 99-minute version titled Mr Arkadin is very rare and quite different from CR (thanks again for the copy Jaime.) CR is frequently billed as being Mr Arkadin, which it isn't. TCM advertised they were going to show Arkadin and showed CR instead.

[chrissie]

Yeah, I wondered about the Criterion comment. Then there's the other guy selling it on ebay who Tim links to where it just says 'European print' and lists 99 mins. Two people trying to sell a print that's supposed to be that running time? Has anyone out there compared this version to the UK release of Confidential Report? $10 is a VERY tempting price...

[chrissie]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws....73&rd=1

They're selling a DVD-R dub of this, I take it? Hmmm... except the $10 one's not around right now... still would like to hear a direct comparison of this vs. the UK DVD.

(Duh, my head hurts a bit with all this 32,427 Arkadins business.)

[R Kadin]

According to Criterion's own laserdisc release catalogue (see if this link works for you), there was a Criterion release under the title, Confidential Report A.K.A Mr. Arkadin some time ago. It was apparently a 2-sided, 12-inch disc with a running time of 99 minutes (which, by the way, corresponds to the actual running time for the Corinth version - despite Corinth's website's misleading 110-minute claim). Presumably, the print associated with it will be used for its upcoming and much-anticipated DVD release, along the lines of F for Fake.

Stefan Droessler's reconstruction, however, seems the one that's going to set the new pace for this cinematic Russian doll when it debuts in Locarno next month.

[The Shadow]

Maybe we can get Jeff to sneak in and record it with his camcorder or cellphone.

If Arkadin is public domain, will the new reconstruction be public domain also? Does that mean any mom and pop store could dub it on their betamax and sell copies on their novelty rack? We'll probably see dubs of it on ebay soon after it premieres.

Knowles-Shadow-Hadji

[R Kadin]

Whoever might be going to Locarno, please, please plead with Herr Droessler to consider making the Munich filmmuseum's Arkadin reconstruction more widely accessible once the festival is over. The film's European popularity alone would likely ensure sales brisk enough to recover the museum's costs - and, assuming it turns out as well as we suspect - it could generate a wide and enthusiastic audience for the lecture circuit.

Since North American distribution prospects are usually an "iffy" proposition, it would be nice to have copies in circulation in Europe for we colonists to tap into should we be left with no other resort.

[Kevin Loy]

If Arkadin is public domain, will the new reconstruction be public domain also? Does that mean any mom and pop store could dub it on their betamax and sell copies on their novelty rack? We'll probably see dubs of it on ebay soon after it premieres.

Mmm...not so sure about that. While the base materials for the reconstruction will still be public domain, this reconstruction will be a unique compilation of already existing materials (which, I would assume, would qualify it as being a "derivative work"...is there anything in this version that is actually unreleased?), so I am pretty sure that allows it some form of copyright protection. I'm not well-versed enough in copyright law to tell you the extent of copyright in this instance, though (which is perhaps a dangerous thing for a musician to say, but then again, I've never registered a film).

That having been said, didn't somebody say that it was quite possible that this new version of Arkadin could be on the upcoming Criterion release? I do recall that there was quite some debate about it, and to be honest, if Criterion didn't include it, it would be a major mistake on their part. But then again, it wouldn't be the first time that Criterion ignored the existence of something extremely important to a release for whatever reason (see also: the first version of John Cassavetes' Shadows. While I do think that Ray Carney is a bit of a raving lunatic, I can't say that I think much more of Gena Rowlands denying the existence of the original film when it clearly does exist, and when Cassavetes himself said repeatedly that there were two versions).