Yet more on OSotW

[Harvey Chartrand]

I hope somebody at Showtime is reading this!

[Jeff Wilson]

Actually, Beatrice did object to the re-make of Ambersons, but RKO sued her over it. Obviously, it came out in RKO's favor one way or the other, since the miniseries was made. I can find the court listing for the case, if anyone is interested. As for Cradle Will Rock and RKO 281, she doesn't have any control over how Welles is portrayed in a fictional sense. Look at how pissed the Sinatra family was over that HBO(?) Rat Pack film; all they could do was withhold Sinatra's music from it, because that was what they controlled.

I don't believe she owns Chimes, either; Bogdanovich said that during the process of putting his re-edit of One Man Band together, that he tried to get a brief clip from it to use in the film, but the rights holder wanted an astronomical fee for it. No mention of the estate was made. The confusion over the rights to Chimes was covered in the New York Times during the early-mid 90s, when a screening was cancelled at the last minute, if anyone wants to hunt the articles down.

The fight over the unfinished films is curious; if one can question why Kodar hasn't fought back against Beatrice in court, then why hasn't Beatrice pursued ownership of the film elements, if she's so sure she owns it all? It's all very much about power games, revenge, and cash, and all the common sense in the world won't change that.

[Fat Annie]

re: Chimes:
It has been said that the film is "Harvey Weinstein's favorite".
It is currently (as of Oct. 10th) listed on the web site: ' The Web Film Release Schedule (USA) ' for re-issue by Miramax Zoe
http://filmreleases.com/filmreleases/reltbd.htm

re: Ms. Welles:

the issue is much greater than OTSW. Most small projects do not have the funding that the Amberson remake ($16 million budget) had to fight the Estate in court. There needs to be some kind of prevailing legal opinion as to the extent of the Estate's legal rights so that they cannot hold up new projects with threats that they may not actually be entitled to make.

[Jeff Wilson]

Regarding the Miramax re-issue of Chimes, I'll believe when I see it. It's been listed as a Miramax project for at least three years, and Miramax clearly has the clout and money to have made it happen by now. They havenn't, and I don't think they ever will. Whether it ever had some basis in fact, or was just a wild rumor, I would think we'd have heard something by now one way or the other. And given Harvey Scissorhands' penchant for "improving" on a director's work, I shudder to think what he'd do to Chimes, given its soundtrack quality. At least he couldn't order reshoots...

[Le Chiffre]

I remember back in 1992, just before the OTHELLO restoration came out, it's producer told me that if things went well with the release, then Beatrice would give them CHIMES AT MIDNIGHT to do as well. He also said that THE IMMORTAL STORY was one of Beatrice's films, but there wasn't any interest in restoring that. OTHELLO then opened to ecstatic reviews and made a decent profit, especially on video. A few years later a newspaper article said that the "correction" of the soundtrack for CHIMES had just about been completed when Miramax mysteriously pulled the plug on the project in 1996. Six years later, as you guys mentioned, the plug is still pulled.

Harvey,
I can see it now: THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND world-premieres on Showtime, preceded by a documentary detailing the torturous history of it's production and subsequent legal entanglements, culminating with an explanation of why Welles' name had to be taken off the credits. Finally the docu would show the Chartres scene from F FOR FAKE ending with Welles' line "Maybe a man's name doesn't mean much after all". Then they would show the complete assembly of TOSOTW, with the credit "Directed by Peter Bogdanovich and Oja Kodar".

I can see it now.

[RKelly]

I interviewed Beatrice Welles-Smith during the re-release of Othello. At the time, she told me that she wanted to follow Othello with a spruced up Chimes at Midnight and then Mr. Arkadin.
I seem to recall newspaper reports a few months later that the ownership of Chimes was cloudy. As for Mr. Arkadin, I think it would be a fine candidate for restoration.
For what it is worth, I found Welles-Smith to be delightful to talk with and very concerned about her father's reputation. I spoke (briefly) with Oja Kodar at a New York showing of Don Quixote several years later and found her equally as protective of Welles' legacy. It is unfortunate (to say the least) that the parties cannot work out a deal that would benefit all concerned.

[jaime marzol]

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ray, it's a pleasure to see you here, it's been a long time. our friend calico posts here also, as store hadji.

very unfortunate that parties with the same interest, beatrice, and oja, are so against each other. every one loses.

[Cole]

The U.S. Copyright to CHIMES AT MIDNIGHT is still held by the original producers of the film. The controversy in the early 90's came up when a restored version of the film was going to be shown at certain theaters in the US. According to an article in the Hollywood Reporter dated October 12, 1992, the people who were going to show the film thought it was in the public domain but were threatened with a lawsuit by the registered owners. They evidently didn't think it was worth the potential litigation expenses, so it was withdrawn from release.

According to the same article, Castle Hill Productions (which did the "enhanced" restoration of OTHELLO) wanted to buy the copyright to CHIMES and release it itself. This is probably what Mteal heard about when he talked to one of the producers of OTHELLO. However, Castle Hill Productions never went through with the deal for reasons unknown to me. There was also an article about this in the NY Times for June 23, 1992. This is probably the article that Jeff remembers, though I only have a short abstract of it.

[Le Chiffre]

You say they were "threatened with a lawsuit by the registered owners"? That sounds like Beatrice, doesn't it?

BTW, here's a good story by an extra on the TOSOTW set
https://web.archive.org/web/20030713032753/http://extraverse.orcon.net.nz/welles.html

[Tony]

Go to www.nsnews.com, and do a search for "Other Side of the Wind"; this will take you to a page with some rare photos of Welles directing Wind in 1970; then click on the link "Citizen Welles"; this will take you to an article by the guy who drives the car when Oja's character is having sex with Bob Random's character. A fascinating comment from Oja: "We were going to go to Europe and make the picture somehow... but Gary Graver called."
Wow... imagine if Gary Graver hadn't called! A different story! A finished "Wind", made by the Italian crew Welles was used to working with? (see "Rosabella"); remember, Welles left Italy because the newspapers reported about his afair with Oja. I guess they were ready to return. I've often thought that Welles shoudn't have returned, as he always seemed to talk some rich Europeon into financing a film, but in America he had a much more difficult time; I wonder why he stayed. Interestingly, when he was going ahead with "Cradle", he was going to make it in Italy (see again "Rosabella"!).

Or..., go to Europe and:no "Wind" at all?

Hmmmm........

[Jeff Wilson]

Staying in America allowed Welled to call upon his many friends in the biz, as well as the various young actors who participated, if nothing else. I would imagine that making the film in Europe would have required it to be completely dubbed (though I'm not sure how much OSotW had to be dubbed anyway).

[Harvey Chartrand]

I think staying in America took the Wind right out of his sales.

The way things turned out, it seems that Orson would have had better luck getting his films made if he'd remained in Europe. But he was tired and getting on and wanted to return to the country of his birth. In a Look magazine article written in 1971 ('Where Do We Go from Here?'), Orson admitted that he was finished in Hollywood, but that if he were closer to the action, he might just be able to nudge himself toward the center of power in the studios and get a few films made before, as it does to all men, death came to George Orson Welles. I also recall that counterculture types wanted him to direct pictures, but these plans always fell through.

[jaime marzol]

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all types of types wanted to do something with welles, but when the looney welles got around the money people, they.... well, realized he as looney. the andrew yule book on bogdanovich has a bit on this. welles was always waiting for, and searching for the dagger that was going to be plunged in his back. this sort of behavior doesn't go over well during contract negotiations.

during his america visit in 1956, and in the 70's, many jobs came and went because of the unseen dagger that welles was always searching for, or because of his ideas, and behavior around the money people.

[Tony]

I remember reading how after the 1975 AFI show a producer phoned Welles' rep the next day and offered them a very reasonable sum to finish "Wind" and to distribute it, but Welles and his manager thought that bigger offers would be forthcomong, so they declined the offer, and then, of course, NO other offers came in.

Reminds me of the problem with distributing "Fake".

[ToddBaesen]

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Here's Jonathan Rosenbaum on what happened with the Showtime deal to finish THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND


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LAWRENCE FRENCH: The rights to THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND were always so complicated, and after nearly twenty years, Oja Kodar got a deal to finish the film with Showtime. Then, along comes Beatrice to wreck the whole thing.

JONATHAN ROSENBAUM: Yes, Showtime came up with a deal that would pay off both the Iranian interests, as well as Oja, and allow the film to be completed. So they both got money. That was always what kept making a deal so difficult. But the minute Beatrice steps into the deal, there's a third party, so it was no longer possible. According to what Oja told me at the Welles symposium in Mannheim, the deal is now dead. You see, Beatrice is only interested in money, not in anything else. The letter she sent to Showtime basically said that the only thing permissible for them to do, was a documentary about THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND. The problem with that, was given the amount of money required to be invested in the project in the first place, they no longer felt it was viable for them. So Beatrice effectively killed it. And to give Oja credit, she's really been more active in trying to get THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND finished than anything else.

LAWRENCE FRENCH: Would Beatrice get any money if the film where to be released theatrically and did as well as OTHELLO, or the re-issue of TOUCH OF EVIL?

JONATHAN ROSENBAUM: No, she wouldn't get anything. The only thing she has the rights to is OTHELLO — the version which she mutilated.

LAWRENCE FRENCH: How would you evaluate the footage of THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND that you've seen.

JONATHAN ROSENBAUM: I find it interesting, although not as interesting as DON QUIXOTE. It's like a lot of other Welles films, in that it's not commercial, and it's not at all what people want or expect from Welles. Something I figured out on my own, and later found out to be true, was at least one sequence was directed by Oja Kodar. It's partly her film, too. She co-wrote the script with Welles, and people aren't going to be able to process that. Even if it does come out, there's always going to be problems with it. It's very dated and rough, although that's the style that Welles wanted. But I think people will think it's a great disappointment and say it's lousy, just exactly like what happened with TOUCH OF EVIL, when that first came out. It's very hard to judge it, having seen it in such an incomplete state. I've also heard very conflicting stories about how much footage there may be. I heard there was a lot of unprocessed footage in France, that might be usable if they pay off the lab. There is also different ideas about how long the film should be. When I first met Oja and Dominique Antoine, the producer on the film, right after Welles died, they both told me they had a 2 hour and 30 minute workprint, and that the film would run nearly 3 hours. Now Oja maintains that's not true, but Dominique Antoine still maintains that's true.

LAWRENCE FRENCH: When I asked Oja about the three hour running time, she said that it was never going to run over two hours, because Welles hated great length in movies.

JONATHAN ROSENBAUM: That's true, but that wasn't what she told me the first time we met. So, it may just be a case of her remembering things differently. The thing is, I trust her impulses more than a lot of other people, because I think she has taste. I mean Gary Graver is a nice guy, but what I've seen of THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WIND is his assembly, so that's why it becomes hard to judge.

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